any advice would help!!!

[n/a]

I was an applicant to a local sheriffs dept. a few months ago.  I passed the oral, background, poly, and medical. The psych. with the doctor did not go well and was unfavorable due to reasons that they can't disclose.  I know how to answer the questions like, "Do you love you family?" well yes.  I am 21 years of age and graduated an academy recently.  I know my age was the factor for not passing the exam ("life experience").  I did not appeal the problem due to I think that it would not be worth it and time and money.  I am now applying with many departments and kind of find it hard to get in.  I do not know if it is because my psych. results or what.  I get through the orals and then they write those letters saying that they found better qualified people but that I am still applicable.  I graduated my class and went through everything with breeze but with hard work.  I know that I am young (21) but proved myself through school.  I put myself through the academy and now I am struggling to land a job.  Can anyone give me there thoughts about the psych. that I took and or give me advice on what to do to land a job.    Thank you

Bubba

California

[junior]

bubba,

sounds as if you are in a tough situation .  sounds as though you are qualified, at least on paper, etc.  many depts look at "life experiences" very heavily.  if they two or more qualified candidates that are for the most part equal, but one is a little older, they will probably go for the older person.  this is only b/c of the tremendous amount of responsibilty that comes with the job.  i am not trying to say that you are irresposible.  but experience in life, common sense, and street smarts, essential to a police officer, generally can't be taught in a academy they have to acquired.  don't give up your time will come .  maybe some of the more seasoned board members will be able to offer a better insight to your situation.
good luck .

junior  8)

[JimCMR]

Bubba;

Junior said it pretty well, an older applicant will have an edge because of life experience.  A few years ago my City raised the applicant age to 25, just to get an older group.  It has since dropped it back to 21, as we shot ourselfs in the foot, and got very few good applicants.

My advise would to fing a good job (I know that is difficult right now), but a job where you have responsibilities well above seeing that the French fries are done.  A couple years work in a responsible position will help a lot.

Since most retirement plans require age 50 and 20 years of service, you have some time on your side.

But, keep at it, it will only get easier.  I highly doubt that departments will get results of your psyc. tests, so I would not sweat that.

Good luck.          JimCMR

['Guest']

In Canada, the age is 21, however, it is very rare for applicants under the age of 24 to get hired.  I know of a girl who was hired in Vancouver, she is 21 and immature.  I believe she has very limited life experience.  When I think of the experiences I have had since the age of 23, for example, I think the early twenties is too young.  I do realize that there are younger people who are mature for their age, but, I still thinks it's too young.  What kind of age range do they hire in the US.  In Canada, it's around 27, but, there is a real lack of qualified applicants applying these days resulting in agencies taking younger applicants.

[n/a]

Out in California there actually are a lot of young law enforcement officers.  I have many friends that I went to school with that are around my age.  I guess I just have to find the department that is willing to take a chance.  It's not like I am 14 years old.  I know there are many immature people trying to get jobs in LE and I guess that is why it might be hurting me.  Shouldn't a department look at performance and maturity?  Thanks for the comments everyone.

"The Sky's The Limit"

Bubba

['Guest']

I am applying with a department in California and all I have left is my psych interview next week. This is kind of disturbing news to hear, as I am 22 years old. I don't have much full-time work experience, because I have been in school my whole life up until now. I have a B.A. from a top notch university and I worked part-time at a police dept. through college. Between school and work I put in at least 50 hour weeks, but this is not considered full time employment. This was touched on briefly in my backgroud investigation and hope it does not become a problem again at my psych next week.

[Charlie]

Bubba--I generally agree with what everyone has commented about thus far but I feel there is one other thing you ought to keep in mind as well that hasn't been mentioned.

I would recommend that you give a lot of thought and consideration to which agencies you REALLY want to work for. You commented: "I am now applying with many departments and kind of find it hard to get in."

My point is this: I find it to be a common trend among a lot of people to take a "blanket" approach to this sort of thing. That is, the basic idea is people think, "Well, if I apply with xxx of departments, surely I'll get hired by one of them or I'll take the first one that offers me a job." This approach can sometimes work against you!   Primarily because of the following reasons:

* A given agency may feel you are not serious about working for their agency - Obviously, agencies invest a lot of money into new personnel especially in training costs alone. Naturally, they want a return for their investment.

* Agencies will possibly wonder why the other agencies you've applied with haven't hired you - Does this mean you are a "bad" person? Should it be held against you? No. Probably not. But the B.I.'s will wonder why you have not been picked up by someone else. Therefore, they might think, "Why should we hire you?"

I would recommend that you select a minimal amount of departments you REALLY have a genuiine interest in working with. Then, concentrate your efforts on those few as opposed to trying to concentrate on 10 agencies.

Also keep in mind that it is common for most people to apply more than once before they are hired! Don't be surprised if you're not hired the first time you apply.

As the old saying goes, "If at first you don't succeed, try, try again!

Charlie

[n/a]

Yes Charlie you are exactly right.  I have thought about that as well and know that I should apply to agencies that I would like to work for.  However, the process just to go to an oral board can take up to months.  Thit is due to when the department has enough applicants.  I have applied to two agencies which I would like to work for and am waiting for that exact same reason.  What I can't do is rely on that department to hire me and would hate to wait several months jus for an oral or background investigation and have something go wrong.  Then I would have to apply somewhere else and then wait again.  Then comes the expiration date on my Post certificate  Maybe you can suggest something that I can say to a department or do.  I have thought about this problem but am kind of in a stuck situation.  Thanks for the advice.  

Bubba

[Charlie]

Bubba--I can only think of a few general things that you could possibly implement that may or may not be of help when you get to that oral board stage:

* Make sure you are dressed appropriately. Which is generally probably something conservative looking, such as a suit and tie. Fresh hair cut, no excessive jewelry, etc. Remember you are not there to make a fashion statement. First impressions are important!

* Again, first impressions: Try and formulate some good answers to oral board questions. Commonly, one of the first questions asked may be one, some or all of the standard below classics:

- Tell us about yourself.
- Why are you applying with our department?
- Why should we hire you?
- What do you know about the department?
- What are your strengths and weaknesses?

* I think your first few minutes are critical. So, while you have the time to ponder, sit back and try to seriously rehearse your responses to some of these questions without rambling too much. Especially with the first question I've listed. Think about it.....

* Do some research about the department you're applying with. Their history, size, specialties, traditions, etc. Believe it or not, I've had that one sprung on me in the past and thankfully, I did some research about the department and came up with a decent answer. 8)

* Be honest with your answers! DON'T get caught up into the "I've got to answer this question correctly OR, I have to tell them what they want to hear!"  

* If possible, continue your education and get a college degree. Remember: it often times is a competitive process. if someone has more education than you, it is possible they might surpass you in qualifications.

It can be, depending upon where you apply, the size of the department, their entrance qualifications, etc. quite a challenge to get on board somewhere.

Seriously, do an honest self-assessment and think about some of those things. It's often times a competitive process.

Good luck!

Charlie

['Guest']

To " worried" and " Bubba"- Did you take the MMPI? That is still the test used by many agencies throughout the country( and definitely here in California).It is usually 560 questions that are not only reworded in a repetitive manner, but are considered by some to be somewhat "sexist"(i.e. if you are a Man, would you rather own a flower shop or be a construction Worker? Or if you are a Woman, would you rather be a mechanic or a nurse?)The MMPI asks if you hear voices,if you believe God is talking to you,do you love your mother/father,etc. It is honestly looking for that fringe of our society that is mentally ill , but in the stereotypical way.Be careful how you answer as you could be or have been profiled based on test questions, and yes, depending on the questions(whether you answered honestly or not) The Dept. Psychiatrist/Psychologist may review and be concerned about certain areas and responses from the test.I can give an example of when I was applying for my agency and the City Psychologist asked about my relationships with women I was 22yrs old and dating an incredibly beautiful 29 yr old women(Believe me, She WAS most mens' fanstasy).Well, needless to say, the 15-20 min interview lasted 45 mins,covering in detail my feelings toward my mother until I realized that the Dr was drawing some "strange" opinions about my girlfriend/mother! Ridiculous!It ended comfortably when I explained the office work environment I was used to and the fact that I was working in a mature setting where I was exposed to more mature when than my own age group, as well as the fact I really didin't differentiate between ages of women I dated only their behavior! Long story , but I wanted to point out that you should relax and answer any questions only after taking a moment to think before you respond.At All times, be at ease and relax when being interviewed by the Psych-They know that many people feel uncomfortable when talking to a "Head Doctor".Here in Calif. alot of the new recruits to Agencies still tend to be in their early to late 20's(for health and " molding" reasons) so don't let anyone intimidate you both on the age issue or life experience issue.As Charlie said, don't apply to "many" agencies as it can make you look  a bit "flakey"- I always advocate 3-5 only.If you feel like you were D.Q'ed unfairly,check with that Dept. for rules of appeal and DO use an outside Psychiatrist/Psychologist...Good Luck ;D

[n/a]

Yes, CplMike, I did take the MMPI.  Those questions that you gave examples about were just like the ones on the test.  Well, I answered those questions honestly and am not sure if that was part of the reason I was disqualified.  The doctor talked to me for 5 minutes out of the 6 hours I was there.  How can a doctor say I am unable to perform the duties of a sheriff when there are no questions pertaining to law and I answered the questions like any normal human would.  I truly believe that I was profiled due to my age  Would it be worth it to really appeal and go through all that work How would other departments look at this  Charlie and Mike thanks for the words of wisdom...

Bubba

['Guest']

Thanks for the advice cplmike, that should help me stay a little calmer at my psych. appointment. By the way, the "would you like the work of a florist" question was on my MMPI- where do they get this stuff?

['Guest']

Dear Bubba- Don't mean to sound like a "fence straddler" but,as always-IT DEPENDS ON YOU ! I'm here in So. Calif. and have been on my Dept. for 11 1/2 yrs, so I've forgotten some of the "road blocks" that come into play for new applicants.Where ever you are,you have to look first at the populace- are the majority of adults in the workforce as well as the Police or Sheriffs Dept. older or younger? Are there other agencies in the area to apply for?If you do contest the Psych findings you WILL need the opinion of a clinical psychiatrist to refute any opinions about you. Be objective and and professional(please don't display the "them" against "me" attitude-this is the organization you want to work for and if hired,you will see dozens of restrictive rules and standards in place on a daily basis.If you don't mind what Sheriffs Dept is it and do they have a website) even if you have an "outside" Psych, be prepared for a long wait or even a disqualification anyway(doesn't mean it will happen, but the chances are 50/50 so stay encouraged).Keep all copies of Doctors findings and if you reapply or apply for another agency in your area, you can have that as ammunition in case the same issues come up.In all you do bear up under the pressure and be patient.If you can't afford the Psych or don't have an H.M.O that can help, check your local or County Mental Health Depts(don't be embarrassed or scared) .If this is what you want, then fight for it! P.S. To " Worried"- I don't know but the MMPI is more than 50 yrs old in its implementation and I'm sure their are books and critiques on the test. I really don't see anything wrong with a "Man" owning or working in a flower shop, as long as it pays his bills and is an honest days labor.And as far as its ability to id psychologically deviant individuals,well lets just say that Charles Manson has passed the MMPI also,hmmmmm?......www.lawa.org/police/

[Drakor]

ok ok so I got to the psych and I answered honestly. I know I could have done better on some of the questions and answers. I was disqualified and told I need to reapply in one year. I can remember all the questions and can even look up what they are looking for for the ones I didn't know. I know I can get passed this. This was the only hold up from gettting hired. I was wondering should I get a second opinion even after my BI told me this was not reviewable. I was alos told by several people to write a letter to the Major telling him how much I want the job. I just don't know what to do. I thought I had it this time.

[JimCMR]

Drakor;  Sorry to hear you got DQed.  In my area, it is usually a complete waste of time and money to try to get things overturned.  I don't know what it is in your area, but I would guess it is pretty much the same.

The best I think you could do is to research the phsyc test and be prepared with the "right" answers next time.  Try a few different departments, maybe you can catch on with a municipal dept, it sounds like you are going for State Police, it is usually tougher there due to the number of applicants.  Try the locals, I think you would be glad you did.

Good luck.       JimCMR