Cocaine

[[e-mail]]

dose anyone know if a one time ( Single incident) cocaine use DQ someone from joining the LAPD?
also if you fail the Poly does it Automatically DQ you?
Is there any way to beat the Poly?

Appreciate help

[Drakor]

I know that cocaine will get you dqed at most of the departments here in Maryland. I'm not sure about the LAPD. Most Departments will let you know from the start what will and will not Dq you.
  The polygraph is a normal part of most Departments process to get hired and will likely disqualify you when you fail the test. I once had a tester ask me what I was thinking about when they asked me a Marijuana question. Evedently my answer was questionable, I knew what  it was before she even told me. I simply told her as soon ask she asked me the question I thought about the times I was around marijuana been to rock concerts where the smoke was so thick that you could barely see the singers. Long story short I passed
    There are many web sites available to explore your options with the polygraph.

[Jay]

As far as ways to beat the polly.  

There are serveral "surefire ways"  however most are simply urban legand.  I would not put my faith in them.  I would just be honest.  Even if you manage to "beat" the exam it will come back to haunt you eventualy.


As far as will you automaticaly get DQ'ed

Yes and no.  Most departments will auto dq for a failed polly, some auto schedule a second polly .   Even if you are Dq'ed you have a chance to apeal with 99.9% of departments.


J

[pdred]

I found a web page you should look at about the poly test
www.antipolygraph.org
take a look at the " lie behind the detector "
good luck

[Jay]

pdred said:

I found a web page you should look at about the poly test
www.antipolygraph.org
take a look at the " lie behind the detector "
good luck

I advise you to be careful in trusting the information found on the site

[Charlie]

User--have you asked a LAPD recruiter about these questions? If not, one source you can possibly check to maybe find this out on your own discreetly is on the LAPD web site at: www.lapdonline.org/index.htm 8)

It usually depends upon what sort of qualifications or requirements a given department goes by concerning the issues you speak of. Is it possible for someone to get hired who has previously "experimented" one time with cocaine? I would say yes it is possible. BUT, I do not know how LAPD views this particular issue.

As for the polygraph, typically, if someone fails the polygraph, they are usually disqualified. Usually, an applicant can apply again at a ater time unless there are other issues at hand that could possibly cause a permanent disqualification.

Good Luck.

Charlie

[George Maschke]

admin said:

I advise you to be careful in trusting the information found on the site

Dear Mr. Hull,

Specifically, what information on AntiPolygraph.org do you believe to be untrustworthy?

Respectfully,

George W. Maschke
AntiPolygraph.org

[George Maschke]

User said:

Is there any way to beat the Poly?

Yes, there is. It's quite simple (which should be reason enough for agencies to abandon polygraph screening). See Chapter 4 of The Lie Behind the Lie Detector (it's free) for details.

While Gino Scalabrini and I did not write this book to help liars beat the system, we believe it is important that all law enforcement applicants be made aware that the polygraph screening process depends on the polygrapher lying to and deceiving the applicant about the nature of the procedure (which we describe in detail in Chapter 3).

LAPD polygraphers are accusing (wrongly in many cases) about half of applicants polygraphed of deception. (See the discussions of the LAPD polygraph program on the AntiPolygraph.org message board for further reading.)

[Jay]

It is not that i nesc find anything to be nessesarly untrustworthy.  It is more that I would not put my faith in anything that is said as far as "beating a polly"  I have taken several in my day and have never been accused as being untruthfull.  I have taken part of training of new polygraph examiners and they never thought my statement to be false when it was true.  They did occasionaly miss a false statement but never the other way arround.   The polygraph is not 100% accurate and I will never say that it is perfect.  I agree that it should not be taken as seriously as it is.  It should just be used as a tool.  I just would not place my dreams of becoming an LEO in the hands of trying to "beat the system"  

Just my 2 cents.

Jay

[cpl_mike]

I work for the City of L.A. and I'll tell you now- BE THRUTHFUL!!!!! Don't be concerned with beating the polygraph, because " we" in L.A. don't need liars or slackers.Police and Fire Selection  Section will do a thorough background, so if law enforcement for the City of L.A. is what you want, be honest and be prepared.Hard drug usage,domestic violence,weapons violations, and poor credit history are all disqualifiers here. and "POST"Rafael Perez/Rampart scandal, being truthful now can save you the misery of lost wages, and jail time later.No one asks you to be an "angel" to be a police officer, but you have to be honest and mature in your dealings and willing to admit faults.contact personnel@ [phone] to address your concerns.If you believe you now have the character to become an officer,please apply and have stay encouraged, the process is long, but the job is worth the wait.Good Luck .www.lawa.org/police

[cpl_mike]

Regarding what G.Maschke said about the LAPD and their polygraph program. It has been nearly 12 yrs since I did my back grounds and polygraphs weren't regularly used then. The City had a Job fair on Oct 13th at the "New Academy near LAX and LAPD recruiters told my people the "horror" stories regarding the "lie detector tests knocking out almost 50% of the incoming group of recruits( academy classes are down to 20-30 recruits,whereas when I came on 60-100 was normal). Is this because the recruits/applicants are dishonest or is this because of false and over zealous examiners  during the polygraph? I think the answer is somewhere in between.BOTTOM LINE, be TRUTHFUL, as you will be given an opportunity to explain any inconsistencies. If you feel you were mistreated and you were honest( and don't meet the D.Q. criteria) you can always  appeal.GOOD LUCK

[George Maschke]

cpl_mike,

If you feel you were mistreated and you were honest (and don't meet the D.Q. criteria) you can always  appeal.

For those truthful applicants who are falsely accused of deception there is no real appeal process. The L.A. Civil Service Commission has delegated appeal authority to the Personnel Department General Manager (at the latter's request). The Personnel Department was a key backer of polygraph "testing" and politically can't afford to be seen reversing many decisions. For further discussion, see the message thread LAPD Polygraph Screening -- Let's End It on AntiPolygraph.org.

With regard to applicants telling the truth, I agree that they should. However, the polygraph process depends on the assumption that applicants will be deceptive in their responses to some of the questions asked (the so-called "control" questions). Perversely, the more honestly an applicant answers the "control" questions, and as a consequence feels more relaxed when answering them, the more likely the applicant is to "fail." (This is explained in detail in Chapter 3 of The Lie Behind the Lie Detector.) By relying on the polygraph, LAPD and other agencies are screening out and falsely branding as liars some of their most conscientious applicants.

Applicants to agencies that rely on polygraphy should be aware that whether or not they are truthful, their polygrapher/interrogator will lie to and attempt to deceive them.

['Guest']

;)While the information you are dispensing here is of value, I think you are missing the point-Many future "cops2be" view this site and need straight forward guidance on their chances or just to be assured against false impressions about a Law Enforcement career. The polygraph issue has been debated for 60 yrs, and as you have pointed George, fallible and "subjective".The  main thing I was trying to express was honesty-period.It is what is expected of me when I put on the uniform everyday and it is what is expected of any other officer/deputy/state trooper throughout the U.S. I personally know of individuals who have appealed to the Civil Service Commission, some successful(3), and some not (7) regarding the polygraph. As you have also mentioned, it depends on the aims and biases of the examiner, as well as the particular agencies prompting and guidelines. A neighbor of mine passed both the L.A. County Sheriffs polygraph and Santa Monica ,CA PDs polygraph, yet he did not pass LAPDs-(he works for the LASO as a deputy now).Is it possible that he is a "cunning liar",or were their different criterias at play( Both LASO and Santa Monica PD have EXTREMELY High standards of professionalism and compete highly as well as surpass LAPD in attracting top notch applicants). I enjoy seeing others such as yourself assist the "hopefuls" here on this site-but be carefult that any info. you give is used to encourage and supplement those processing who want to be true  to the profession, not support those looking for "short cuts ".

[George Maschke]

Cpl. Mike,

You wrote:

I enjoy seeing others such as yourself assist the "hopefuls" here on this site-but be carefult that any info. you give is used to encourage and supplement those processing who want to be true  to the profession, not support those looking for "short cuts ".

AntiPolygraph.org's purpose in making detailed information about polygraph "testing" freely available (including how to pass a polygraph "test") is to help protect honest applicants from harm. In doing so, however, it is not possible to prevent deceptive persons from also putting this information to use.

Mike, you exhort others to "honesty - period," but note that the LAPD and other agencies that rely on pseudoscientific polygraph "testing" are themselves being blatantly dishonest with every single applicant or employee who is polygraphed.

[Drakor]

     Views on polygraphs are as debated as politics and religion. Which came first the egg or the chicken?
    This website is devoted to women and men who for whatever reason have decided to choose law enforcement as a career. Honesty is the best policy and as far as I'm concerned is the best way to start out such a career.
    I'll simply say that the Web is full of good and bad websites concerning polygraphs. But... this website is not for such a debate. Whether or not polys are fair, accurate or just most of us will at one time or another have to take one to get on board with a police department. I think it's good to study for whatever test you take. Learn as much as you can...so your not scared half to death by the miths.
         The only thing we have to fear.....is fear itself...